Source: Smart Investors
Highlights
1. Without semiconductors, there is no AI. And storage is the backbone of AI, the critical foundation supporting the continuous evolution of AI.
2. As models get larger and inference demand continues to grow, the demand for storage will only increase—it requires greater capacity, higher performance, and lower power consumption.
3. As early as 2021, we said the industry needed new fabs built from scratch. It's just that no one truly predicted AI would explode at such a fast pace.
4. The tight supply across the industry will persist beyond 2026, and for a considerable period of time.
5. Memory is a very, very difficult technology. No one should underestimate how much technology and engineering capability is required behind producing memory. In some ways, memory is even harder than other parts of semiconductors.
6. A leader must be able to see the big picture and, when necessary, dive into the details. Only then can a company ensure it unleashes its maximum potential.
7. Investment is never made blindly; it must be disciplined and based on data. You need to understand the technology, the applications, and where those applications are going. You also need to work closely with customers, understand where they are headed in the future, and what role Micron plays in that.
Listening to Micron Technology CEO Sanjay Mehrotra talk about storage gives a sense of calm conviction.
Micron is a global leader in memory and storage, and the only US-based manufacturer of DRAM. Before last week's "Black Friday," the company's market cap had already crossed into the "trillion-dollar club."
While on a business trip in South Korea, Nvidia founder Jensen Huang, while signing a partnership with another memory giant, SK Hynix, optimistically declared, "No end in sight for memory shortage."
Against this backdrop, listening to Sanjay's in-depth conversation becomes even more meaningful.
Sanjay's career spans the entire flash revolution: joining Intel in 1980, later co-founding SanDisk, playing a central role as flash memory moved from the periphery to the mainstream.
Since becoming Micron's CEO in 2017, he has led the company's systematic transformation from a follower to a technology leader and announced a $200 billion US domestic manufacturing investment plan.
Recently, Micron's expansion project at its Manassas, Virginia, fab produced its first wafers; leading-edge process fabs in Boise, Idaho, and Syracuse, New York, are progressing simultaneously.
The host of this conversation is Jodi Shelton, co-founder and CEO of the Global Semiconductor Alliance, who has been immersed in the semiconductor industry for decades and maintains long-term working relationships with the leadership of nearly all top chip companies.
In January of this year, she launched the podcast "A Bit Personal," dedicated to in-depth personality interviews with semiconductor leaders. Guests already featured include former TSMC CEO, MediaTek CEO, Broadcom's Semiconductor Group President, etc. It is this accumulation that allows her to steer conversations toward far more personal levels than earnings calls or summit speeches.
The interview was recorded at Sandy's home. His interviews with financial media mostly focus on business and industry perspectives; it's extremely rare for him to proactively discuss personal experiences, making this an exception.
Jodi said that compared to the scale of business Sandy oversees, she was more interested in questions like: How does one bear responsibility in such a position? In a highly cyclical, high-pressure industry, what kind of discipline and long-term thinking do leaders need? How do you stay grounded when standing at the center of global demand?
These questions are answered in the conversation.
Topics covered range from the fundamentals of memory supply and demand, the technical difficulty of High Bandwidth Memory, the ramp-up pace of building fabs from scratch, to judgments about an AI bubble, and the decision-making logic behind Micron's $200 billion investment.
There is also a very personal thread. An engineer from an Indian middle-class family, denied a visa three times, whose father intercepted the returning consul after lunch and argued passionately for 20 minutes to secure his son's opportunity to come to the US. An arranged marriage of 42 years, where his wife's comment, "You have a nice smile, smile more," changed how he presented himself in all public appearances thereafter... These are things never seen in earnings reports or strategy documents.
This is not just a conversation about technology; it's also a conversation about leadership under pressure. Smart Investors (ID: Capital-nature) presents it in full. Enjoy it~
Extended reading: The market misread the non-farm payrolls data! "Woodsie" deeply dissects the US stock market's "Black Friday," offering many non-consensus views...
Thoughts on Participating in the White House Delegation to China
Jodi I am honored to be in your home, such a beautiful home, and also in your office. There must be many stories behind these bookshelves behind you. Are there any books here that you particularly like?
Sanjay Actually, there are quite a few, really quite a few.
When we travel to different places, we also enjoy collecting local books. So there are many books here related to those travel experiences.
For example, here's a book about the Bhagavad Gita. That's one of the holy scriptures of Hinduism. Sometimes flipping through a few pages is quite interesting.
Jodi We were originally supposed to do this interview a few weeks ago, but I got "intercepted" by Trump.
You were invited to join the White House delegation to China. So tell us, what was that experience like? What was it like getting that call? What was the actual trip like?
Sanjay It was, of course, a great honor and a very special opportunity to represent Micron in that, a very rare experience.
That morning, President Trump received CEOs in Washington, and I was part of that. The attending CEOs also had the honor of witnessing President Xi Jinping's welcome ceremony for him. Seeing such a scene was indeed very exciting.
We also participated in some bilateral dialogues. President Trump introduced the CEOs during the bilateral talks, and again at the evening banquet.
Overall, seeing the US and China sitting together, building communication toward a more stable relationship, I think is a good thing.
It's good for everyone.
Jodi Dialogue itself is good, even if there aren't very concrete results yet.
Sanjay Couldn't agree more.
Jodi So what do you hope will come after this?
Sanjay As a business leader, I certainly hope to see an environment that encourages innovation, provides a platform for innovation, and benefits all companies.
At the same time, I also hope for greater stability, predictability, and certainty in investment.
Jodi Right. So, did you ride on Air Force One?
Sanjay I did not.
Jodi Okay. I was going to ask if you took any souvenirs from the plane.
Sanjay Really didn't.
Storage is Becoming a Critical Foundation for Artificial Intelligence
Jodi I have been very much looking forward to this conversation. Because you, Micron, and the entire memory industry are almost at the center of this era.
Now, whenever AI is discussed, three issues are unavoidable: computing power, storage, and energy. In other words, your importance has perhaps never been as visible to the outside world as it is today. How do you see this moment? What does it feel like to be in the middle of it?
Sanjay I've been in this industry for over 45 years now. I can say this is the most exciting time for the entire industry I have experienced.
And I truly believe the best is yet to come.
Today, memory is no longer just a component in devices like smartphones and PCs; it is becoming a critical foundation for artificial intelligence. In other words, memory is not just making devices run; it is supporting the "intelligence" itself within AI, helping artificial intelligence become smarter.
So, the opportunity before the memory industry is enormous. This is indeed a very exciting moment.
I am also very proud of the Micron team. Micron is the only company manufacturing semiconductor memory in the United States.
For decades, our team has been advancing the memory technology roadmap and product roadmap, bringing us to this point—where memory has become a core component of the AI revolution.
I have always believed Micron is a "national treasure." Now, especially in this AI revolution, the world is also seeing why Micron is such an important national treasure.
Jodi Every decision you make now will have ripple effects throughout the industry, potentially even affecting the global economy.
How do you cope with that pressure? Do you have any daily habits, rituals, or certain beliefs that help you stay steady, stay clear-headed?
Sanjay I think the most important thing is the team.
I am very fortunate to have worked with many team members for a long time. As I said earlier, Micron is a national treasure; there are many strong leaders within the company. They were already there when I joined Micron.
At the same time, there are also leaders I worked with early in my SanDisk days.
Bringing these people together forms a team I sincerely believe is among the best in the semiconductor industry. They have very deep industry experience. For me personally, this is the most important asset. It helps me address opportunities within the industry and business, and also tackle challenges that arise from time to time.
Jodi We are in your home; I also just met your wife. It feels very peaceful here.
So that must be part of the reason too, right? If someone comes from a peaceful family environment, they might not be as easily crushed by immense pressure from the outside.
Sanjay Absolutely correct.
The support from family is extremely important. My wife has always been a major source of strength, peace, and composure for me.
The memory industry, the semiconductor industry, has experienced too many ups and downs. So having such a support system at home is undoubtedly a great advantage and a very important foundation.
The Tight Supply Across the Industry Will Persist Beyond 2026, and for a Considerable Period of Time
Jodi Then let's talk about these cycles.
You've been in this industry a long time, experienced many cycles. The semiconductor industry inherently has cycles, and within semiconductors, memory is the most volatile sector in terms of cycles. It could be a peak today, entering a downturn tomorrow, something you've certainly experienced many times.
Today is clearly a feast time for you. You've entered the trillion-dollar club, have a lot of cash, and the company's stock price, or rather its valuation, doubled in 48 days.
Looking at this journey, it's indeed very impressive.
Do you think this is just another memory cycle, albeit on a larger scale? Or can AI truly change the cyclical nature of this industry?
Sanjay I believe, without semiconductors, there is no AI; and storage is the backbone of AI, the critical foundation supporting the continuous evolution of AI.
As models get larger and inference demand continues to grow, as AI moves from training to inference, from data centers to the edge, the demand for storage will only increase.
It requires greater capacity, higher performance, and lower power consumption.
Only with these conditions can artificial intelligence progress from one generation of models to the next, from one inference application to the next, continuously improving its level of intelligence.
Now there's also Agent AI; as it develops, AI orchestration becomes more complex, leading to very significant growth in storage demand.
Whether it's GPU platforms, TPU platforms, or ASIC platforms, they all need more and more memory.
So we first need to look at the demand side. Storage is a key enabler of AI's intelligent capabilities. The essence of intelligence is data, and data is inseparable from storage.
If you look at token economics, it also heavily relies on storage. As token usage grows, context windows become longer, KV cache demand increases, and the models themselves get larger. AI needs not just computing power, but also the ability to "remember."
It needs more storage and higher-performance storage.
So from the demand side, all of this is still at a very, very early stage. We believe AI still has a long way to go.
But on the other hand, the supply side is equally important. To understand the complete dynamics of this industry, you must look at both demand and supply simultaneously.
On the supply side, supply is extremely tight relative to demand right now.
The reason is that high-bandwidth memory, high-performance memory—and not just HBM, but also future products like LP6 DRAM—are critical components for data centers and various edge devices.
These products require a lot of wafers. Because the higher the performance, the larger the chip die area tends to be, thus requiring more wafers.
To support this demand, a large amount of new greenfield fab capacity is needed.
Building a fab takes a long time. After the building is constructed, you still need to install equipment, qualify the production line, and gradually ramp up to volume production, which also takes a long time.
So you must look at both the demand side and the supply side simultaneously. On these two dimensions, the fundamentals of our industry have already changed.
Jodi But once the supply side catches up and the industry reaches some balance, the situation usually reverses. That is, there might be oversupply. Do you think that could happen in the next five years? If this is still a cycle, and we are in the upward phase now, then the subsequent adjustment could also be very sharp.
Sanjay What I would say is, AI is still in its early stages.
As AI, intelligence, and Agent AI continue to develop, more and more storage will be needed in the future. At the same time, supply is still far below demand.
I cannot predict exactly when supply will truly catch up with demand. But we see the tight supply across the industry persisting beyond 2026, and for a considerable period of time.
You still have to go back to the fundamentals.
How does supply increase? Mainly through new greenfield fabs. From breaking ground to producing the first wafers usually takes three to four years. Then you still need to continue ramping up, gradually increasing the output.
Of course, the production ramp will also proceed based on the latest demand assessments.
Another important point: the technology itself is becoming more difficult. The productivity gains from each new generation of technology—the bit increase per wafer—are getting smaller.
Combining these factors means that for the foreseeable future, the industry's supply-demand fundamentals will remain healthy.
Jodi When did you first realize that AI wouldn't be just another ordinary technology transition?
Sanjay The emergence of ChatGPT in the fall of 2022 changed the world and also brought a huge inflection point in the demand environment.
But as early as around 2020, we had already seen AI gaining momentum. At that time, we were seriously discussing how storage would become a core enabler for AI.
By around 2021, Micron had already started talking externally about this issue, that more supply would be needed in the future.
Because at that time we saw that products like high-bandwidth memory, and their future roadmap, would require more and more silicon.
At that time, high-bandwidth memory's share in the entire memory industry was still very small, maybe only about 1% or so.
But we could already see that future generations of high-bandwidth memory would require a lot of silicon, HBM itself would experience tremendous growth, and have a major impact on the supply landscape.
So as early as 2021, we said the industry needed new fabs built from scratch. It's just that no one truly predicted AI would explode at such a fast pace.
For both logic chips and memory chips, no one predicted demand would grow this quickly.
Jodi Yes. I was in China last October, that was the first time I heard some voices more clearly, saying there might be a severe memory shortage in the market.
I remember it seemed like CXMT mentioned their capacity for the next two years was already sold out. That was the first time I truly heard that kind of statement. Of course, there were some sporadic voices before that.
For you, when did you start to realize: "Okay, we might be heading into a severe capacity crunch"?
Sanjay I think as early as our earnings call in December 2023, we already discussed that supply of leading-edge memory would start to tighten in 2024.
By 2025, we saw memory supply tightening further. And it's not just leading-edge memory that's tight; even some long-lifecycle products, like DDR4, started to tighten. These products are used in automotive, industrial, networking, and other applications.
So, it's a relatively broad-based tightness.
From late 2023 into 2024, we had already seen these trends forming and began discussing them externally.
But as I said earlier, we actually started planning related investments around 2021, 2022.
Jodi But 2023 was a brutal year for the entire semiconductor industry. And it was precisely at that time that some capacity expansion investments were slowed down.
Sanjay Yes.
Embracing AI, Utilizing AI is Very Important
Jodi Our industry often talks about technology, innovation, but relatively less about the responsibilities these technologies bring. So, how do you see Micron's responsibility regarding AI? Do you personally worry about AI?
Recently, some social backlash has started to appear. For example, some commencement speakers, whenever they mention AI, get booed by the audience. How do you view this unease?
Sanjay I understand these concerns, especially regarding jobs being affected by AI.
But I believe we must also see the other side: AI will unleash tremendous innovative capability. Many long-unsolved problems now have opportunities to be addressed. And every major innovation also creates new opportunities.
Looking at demographics, especially in developed countries, populations are aging. I believe the productivity gains brought by AI will be an important force for these countries to maintain GDP growth.
As for Micron's responsibility, I think there are mainly two layers: one toward customers, and one toward our own team.
Over the past few years, we have been driving Micron's transformation, aiming to make Micron a clear technology and product leader in the memory space. Today, Micron already has the industry's most comprehensive technology and product portfolio, backed by the efforts of tens of thousands of team members.
At the same time, our customers will continue to invest in AI. In the coming quarters, industry-wide capital expenditure could reach trillions of dollars.
So we must continuously introduce advanced products and provide supply that meets customer needs, supporting their AI innovation. This is a major responsibility and something our entire team is striving to do.
Jodi This morning, I saw Erin Brockovich on a morning show.
She mentioned that many communities aren't truly involved in decision-making, only to find data centers being built near their homes, bringing issues like rising electricity bills and increased water pressure.
So I was wondering, might AI also face increasing social backlash?
Sanjay Of course, societal issues must be seriously considered. The development of AI should bring benefits to communities and broader populations.
I believe as AI continues to advance, it will bring many changes we cannot even imagine today and create new opportunities. In the long run, these changes will ultimately benefit communities.
Of course, jobs will also change. New jobs will appear, some jobs will disappear.
Therefore, embracing AI, utilizing AI is very important. Everyone needs to learn to leverage AI to unlock greater potential.
Family and the Influence of Some Key Figures
Jodi Let's go back to your childhood, before Micron, before SanDisk, before Berkeley, even before you came to the US.
Can you take us back, what was the Mehrotra family childhood like? How did your family environment influence who you later became?
Sanjay My background is very ordinary. I come from a middle-class family in India.
When I was little, we had no TV, no telephone. Our family got its first refrigerator when I was just entering adolescence.
So, it was indeed a very modest beginning.
My parents always lived within many constraints, but they always put their children first, especially emphasizing education.
I grew up in an environment that placed great importance on family. Family always came first; family values were very important.
My father was a man of extremely strong convictions. Whatever values he believed in, no matter how difficult the reality, he would stick to them. My mother was very calm, very composed.
Our family was not wealthy and experienced many ups and downs, including financial difficulties. But no matter how difficult the environment, my parents always focused on the children and always prioritized education.
Jodi You said your father would stick to certain values, even when it wasn't easy to do so.
Could you be more specific about what those values were? Were there times when it would have been easier to step back, but he still chose to stand his ground?
Sanjay For him, equality was very important. For example, men and women should be treated the same.
You have to remember, I'm talking about India in the 1960s.
We had two brothers and two sisters in our family. But in that era, my father would say he had four sons, not two sons and two daughters.
In India in the '60s, he sent my sister to an engineering college. At that time, our extended family thought he might be crazy. Because back then, there were very few girls in Indian engineering colleges.
That's one of the values my father insisted on.
Another thing, he believed in what was right and would stick to it.
Growing up in India, you could see various corrupt practices in society. But my father would never participate in them. Even if it meant facing difficulties himself, he would not support any corrupt behavior.
He indeed got into trouble many times because of this, but never wavered.
Jodi That explains a lot about you. It also explains why you've always supported women's rights and pushed for more women to enter our industry. This story makes me understand you better, so I'm glad you shared it.
In your family, how did your parents define "success"?
Sanjay In our family, success first meant being together as a family, respecting each other, caring for each other, staying connected.
Success also meant respecting elders, respecting the values the family held dear.
Of course, for the children, success also meant receiving a good education.
Jodi Understood. So all four of you children received a good education later on?
Sanjay Yes.
Jodi Did you all become engineers later?
Sanjay Three of us started out as engineers. The fourth initially studied dietetics, nutrition-related courses, but later also switched to engineering.
So all four of us became engineers later and all worked in engineering-related fields.
Jodi Wow, that's impressive.
So were you a particularly serious child and a very diligent student? I'd like to hear if you have any mischievous stories.
Sanjay Overall, I was a diligent student and relatively quiet.
Of course, there were times when I got into trouble for being mischievous.
Especially during university in India. Because I studied two years of university in India first, then transferred to Berkeley to complete my undergraduate degree.
Back then, if a certain professor's lecture was particularly boring, but attendance was important, sometimes we would mark attendance first, then slip out of the classroom through a window or the door, to avoid enduring the rest of the class.
My friends and I did things like that sometimes. Sometimes even the whole class would decide to skip together.
Jodi Aside from family members, what other people, places, or events had a significant influence on you, pushing you onto the path you're on today?
Sanjay One of the most important events, which I often talk about.
That was after I completed two years of university in India. I was 18 at the time. My father always had a dream to send me to the US for higher education.
He actually didn't have sufficient financial means, nor a very clear plan on how exactly to support it. But he just had this dream, to send me to America.
Of course, I must also thank my older brother. He was already in the US at the time. He supported my father's dream, saying he would do his best to support me. Keep in mind, he was also very young then, probably in his late twenties.
So, with an acceptance letter from a US university, I went to the American embassy, but got my visa denied three times.
After something like that happened, my father didn't accept the outcome. He said he wanted to speak with the consul on duty.
That consul happened to be out for lunch. When he returned, my father basically intercepted him.
I must say, that consul was a good person, and we were lucky; he actually let us into his office.
For the next 20 minutes or so, my father made a presentation on my behalf.
At that moment, he was my father, my lawyer, and my coach all in one.
He spoke passionately for a full 20 minutes, almost without stopping. He asked the consul why they were denying me this opportunity to come to America? Didn't they realize what a huge loss this would be for me?
He also said that by denying me, America would also lose a very excellent student.
20 minutes later, that consul took my passport and stamped the visa.
Jodi Wow.
Sanjay For me, that was an unforgettable lesson taught by example. I saw it firsthand and learned a lot from it.
It was at that moment I understood: If you want to succeed, first you need resilience, you need the drive not to give up.
My father simply refused to give up.
Of course, I've always understood we were lucky. If that consul hadn't returned, or wasn't willing to listen, he could have just told us to leave.
So, resilience is certainly important, but luck also undoubtedly played a very important role.
There are also other people who profoundly influenced me. Like my professor at Berkeley. It was 1979, I had just finished my master's and was looking for a job. He gave me a lot of guidance and steered me towards Intel.
Later I joined George Perlegos's team. He also became my mentor.
George was a star in the non-volatile memory field at Intel at the time. I learned a lot from him.
He taught me one thing as early as the early '80s: Engineering is not just design.
I studied design engineering and started in the industry as a design engineer. But he told me that engineers designing chips must also pay attention to testing, manufacturability, and quality. These are all responsibilities a chip design engineer must bear.
I learned this discipline from him very early on. To this day, I still thank him for training me to be a good engineer.
Later, Eli Harari, the main founder of SanDisk, helped me transition from an engineer, an engineering manager, into a business leader.
So, my father, my Berkeley professor, my first boss in the industry George Perlegos, and SanDisk's main founder Eli Harari, all profoundly shaped my career.
I must also add, my wife has played a very important role in my life journey. If she hadn't sacrificed her own career to raise our daughters, I couldn't have come this far.
She was once a highly respected accountant and also served as a finance director in the tech industry. But in the late '90s, to support the children, she gave up her career.
That also allowed me to focus more on my own career path.
Jodi Good. This is interesting. In our industry, there are many Indian-origin leaders. They seem to share some common traits: very ambitious, very driven, very disciplined, and also very resilient.
Do you think these traits also apply to other Indians you've worked with in the industry?
Have these traits helped you? For example, coming to the US as an outsider, do these experiences, these character traits, end up helping you instead?
Sanjay One's upbringing certainly shapes who they are. It shapes your character and influences your leadership style.
Undoubtedly, many Indians who came into the US tech ecosystem experienced extremely fierce competition. First in India, to get into the best schools; then coming to the US, getting into schools here.
So, competition, and surviving and thriving in competition, these things are indeed deeply ingrained in us.
India has 1.4 billion people. Even at the school stage, high school stage, competition is already very intense.
Also, India is a developing country with many resource constraints. Many of us come from relatively modest beginnings, from middle-class families, like I described my own upbringing.
So, learning to operate within constraints, I believe eventually gets ingrained in our DNA in some way.
If you think about it, that's also a very important part of running a business.
Another point, India is a very diverse country. You grow up in a diverse environment, so you naturally learn to respect different perspectives, to listen to different voices. That ultimately helps as well.
Finally, think about those of us who came to the US as students. We left our familiar environment for a completely new, unfamiliar place. Adaptability becomes very important.
Like when I came to Berkeley, I didn't know a single person, hadn't even arranged a place to live yet.
In such a situation, you have to learn to adapt. Coming to a foreign country, entering a new education system, adapting to a new cultural environment, that certainly pushes you out of your comfort zone.
These experiences bring a kind of cultural flexibility.
So, putting these factors together, they do help in running a business.
And when you come here as a foreign student, you become very focused on gaining stability, establishing your place. You also have a strong hunger. That is always helpful in business as well.
Jodi Makes sense. And it's not just the semiconductor industry. Looking globally, you'll find many large companies are now managed by Indian-origin leaders. It's indeed a very interesting phenomenon.
Did your siblings also come to the US later?
Sanjay Yes, they all did.
Jodi Did your parents come to the US later as well?
Sanjay My parents came to the US in the 1980s later on.
Jodi So they saw part of your career success?
Sanjay They certainly saw some of my career success during my SanDisk days.
Jodi Were they proud of you?
Sanjay Yes. Both my father and mother were very proud of me.
I know if they were still here today, seeing Micron enter the trillion-dollar market cap club, they would certainly continue to cheer for me, for Micron.
My father sometimes was so proud it was almost embarrassing. He would talk about me and my siblings to others, talk so much that I'd sit there feeling awkward, sometimes having to leave the room.
Micron is Investing $200 Billion in the US
Jodi The past few years have been really interesting for our industry. Probably starting around 2016, the outside world began to truly notice the semiconductor industry.
By 2020, even ordinary consumers understood how important semiconductors were, because they couldn't buy the cars they wanted, or the refrigerators they wanted.
And today, semiconductors stand at a position of high importance for everyone, every nation, including national security.
How do you view this change in recognition of the semiconductor industry?
Do you worry that governments—whether the US government, Indian government, or other governments—are getting too involved in this industry?
Sanjay Micron is investing $200 billion in the US, bringing leading-edge memory manufacturing, as well as long-lifecycle memory product manufacturing, back to the US.
Just last Friday, our expansion and modernization project at the Manassas, Virginia fab began producing its first wafers. This project primarily targets long-lifecycle products.
In Boise, Idaho, and Syracuse, New York, we are also investing in building leading-edge memory fabs.
So clearly, the importance of semiconductors, and certainly the importance of memory, and how critical memory is to AI, is now not only fully recognized by the US government but also by governments around the world.
For the semiconductor industry, this is certainly a good position to be in.
Of course, it also means we have a great responsibility.
Wherever we have offices, wherever we operate, we must support the development of local teams, local communities, and the continuous growth of our business there.
Jodi So how do you think the US is doing in terms of global competitiveness now?
Sanjay I think the US is doing very well.
Looking at Micron, we are the US memory leader, and the only company manufacturing memory in the Western Hemisphere. Micron is doing very well now.
The US still leads in innovation, leads in technology. You can also see this in how AI models are evolving, how inference solutions are advancing.
Of course, such exciting opportunities will also bring very intense overseas competition. China is certainly a source of competition as well.
But I think the US is in a good position, capable of maintaining its lead.
A Leader Must be Able to See the Big Picture and, When Necessary, Dive into the Details
Jodi Over the years, observing changes in leadership styles in the semiconductor industry has also been very interesting. It's not just the leaders themselves that have changed; leadership styles have changed a lot.
In the past, the industry's management style was quite tough, even somewhat brutal. Think of Morris Chang's experiences in the Texas Instruments era. I'm sure you may have experienced a similar style early in your Intel days.
But today, the leadership style seems to have become gentler, more humane.
Do you agree with that statement? If so, why do you think this change happened?
Sanjay I think in its early days, the semiconductor industry was indeed a very fast-paced, very aggressive industry.
Technological progress was fast, product innovation was constant, applications expanded from personal computers to mobile phones to cloud computing. So it was a rapidly evolving industry.
But I think the industry gradually realized later that a company is not just about technology, products, manufacturing, business, revenue, and profit. It's also about culture.
The semiconductor industry has increasingly emphasized culture, and that has indeed brought about a change in leadership styles across the industry.
Jodi Yes. You've built an excellent culture at Micron, clearly intentionally. So how would you describe your own leadership style?
Sanjay My leadership style is first and foremost being able to dive deep into details when necessary. I am indeed engineering-driven and place great importance on data.
But at the same time, I also rely heavily on the team, emphasize acting quickly, and am very customer-centric.
I can tell you, in my early leadership roles at SanDisk, some might have said I managed very closely because I would get very deeply involved in various details.
Even today, some might say that when necessary, I still manage closely.
But personally, I think in our industry, technology changes very fast, products change very fast, customers change very fast, and competition changes very fast. Therefore, a leader must be able to see the big picture and, when necessary, dive into the details. Only then can a company ensure it unleashes its maximum potential.
I do believe this balance is necessary, and I am able to drive that balance.
But to do that, you must be close enough to engineering, and you must also have a very strong leadership team and fully trust those leaders.
Ultimately, everything still depends on the team. My leadership style is largely built on having a strong team.
Jodi You personally are very quiet, very low-key. Is that deliberate, or is it just your natural personality?
Sanjay It is indeed part of my personality. I am naturally relatively quiet.
Of course, in some situations, I also consciously choose to listen. To listen first, process information, analyze, think, and then make decisions.
I believe listening is extremely important.
Jodi Right. So how would you describe Micron's culture?
Sanjay Micron's culture is one that allows everyone to express their views.
We often say we want to hear all ideas, then let the best idea win.
We work very hard to encourage people to speak up. When they see something that could be done differently, better, faster, at lower cost, or when they notice something isn't right, there's room for improvement, we want them to raise their hand and say it.
Micron is a very resilient company. Surviving in the memory industry for 47 years certainly requires tremendous resilience. So, "resilience" is a deeply rooted value at Micron.
"People first" is also one of Micron's core values.
I think this can be traced back to the company's early founders in Boise. Even as Micron grew into a global company, this ability to care for people, understand people, especially collaborate across different cultures, remains a very important part of Micron's culture.
Additionally, innovation is certainly deeply rooted at Micron.
Look, the memory industry once had dozens of companies. Today only a few remain. In DRAM, there are truly only three major companies. And the US has only one DRAM company, that's Micron.
This certainly depends on Micron's continuous innovation and its ability to translate innovation into company advantage.
We have transformed Micron's culture from that of a follower, a survivor, into that of a clear leader today. Micron isn't just about surviving; it's about truly thriving.
The Micron team is now very focused on one thing: winning.
People Underestimate the Difficulty of Manufacturing Memory
Jodi I've always felt Micron is a very progressive company. That's not easy for a company with such a long history.
And it's in the memory industry. In the past, people might have thought memory wasn't such a sexy technology. Of course, that's certainly different now.
Sanjay This is something I'd really like to correct.
This is also where people often misunderstand memory; they underestimate the difficulty of manufacturing memory.
Think about it, manufacturing these memory chips involves physics, chemistry, material science, and a tremendous amount of engineering capability. You have to design these chips, mass-produce them, ensure their reliability, quality, and testability, and ramp them up to high-volume production.
And you must ensure every single one of the trillions of bits in a product functions correctly.
There are enormous physics and science problems involved. It's hard, really, really hard.
And now, it's getting even harder. Because today's challenge isn't just process scaling, but how to deliver the performance that truly enables AI. From data centers to the edge, you need to provide higher capacity, higher performance in the various required packaging forms.
That's what I think people often underestimate.
Memory is a very, very difficult technology. No one should underestimate how much technology and engineering capability is required behind producing memory.
It's no simpler than any other part of the semiconductor industry. In some ways, I'd even say it's harder.
Selecting a Team, Capability and Performance are Always at the Core
Jodi Okay, correction accepted. Thank you.
Now there's an increasingly prominent question: Should inclusion be implemented as genuine opportunity or remain as gesture and rhetoric?
You've always supported the Global Semiconductor Alliance's Women's Leadership Initiative and repeatedly emphasized that for the semiconductor industry to continue growing, it cannot ignore half the talent. It's never about lowering standards, but about making more people willing to enter this industry, and once in, able to stay and develop.
How do you think we're doing now? How can we turn inclusion into real opportunity, not just surface-level?
Sanjay I think you just said the key word: it's never about sacrificing standards of capability.
In the semiconductor industry, if your team isn't composed of the best people, if you don't put capability and performance at the core, you cannot succeed.
That has always been a focus at Micron as well.
As I said earlier, if you want to drive innovation, create the best outcomes for the business, you must hear all ideas.
Let all ideas surface, then decide which are the most worthy to pursue.
Providing such an environment where everyone can express their views, where they can debate these views and move forward together, I think that's very important.
This is also a natural part of Micron.
At Micron, the company now holds over 61,000 patents. We are a true innovation powerhouse, among the top innovative enterprises globally.
Micron has an inventor whose patent count now exceeds that of Einstein.
Jodi Wow.
Sanjay I believe he ranks among the top five inventors in the US, approximately.
So, innovation is thriving at Micron.
Regarding women innovators, we also launched a women's innovation program a few years ago. The number of women innovators at Micron continues to grow.
We attach great importance to this. Because intellectual property is a competitive advantage. Intellectual property and innovation are exactly what differentiate your technology and products.
We put a lot of work into ensuring the message is communicated to all team members across the company: innovation matters, intellectual property matters.
And innovation isn't just about technology or product innovation. It also includes business processes. That is, how to do things better, how to do things differently.
Especially now, as we drive AI transformation internally within the company, there are many innovation opportunities.
It's not about simply grafting AI onto old business processes. Now is the time to reimagine what we're doing, then incorporate AI elements.
All of this is part of Micron's culture.
And if we weren't fostering an inclusive culture where everyone can speak up, express their views, and also be willing to listen to others, none of this would happen.
Jodi If there are young women now in university pursuing STEM fields, and performing very well, perhaps studying electrical engineering or physics. What would you say to them? How would you encourage them to join the semiconductor industry?
Sanjay I would say, come join Micron.
Now is the best time for the semiconductor industry, with many exciting opportunities ahead.
Join the industry, be part of it. Participate in the changes and transformations about to happen in our industry.
And I'm not just saying this to those already studying semiconductor-related courses in university.
I'd also like to say it to younger students, like middle schoolers, high schoolers. I really hope they can be inspired to pursue STEM.
Over the past few years, Micron has been bringing what we call "Chip Camp" programs to communities across the US, especially where we have operations.
We have team members participate, go into middle and high schools, bring basic knowledge about chips, semiconductors to these students, make them aware of the power of semiconductors, spark their interest in science, in STEM.
This is really, really important for building the future workforce domestically in the US.
Our $200 billion investment will create approximately 90,000 new jobs across the ecosystem.
So Micron must take responsibility, invest in bringing more people into the semiconductor workforce. Not just women, but also veterans, people from all backgrounds.
We need more people to join. Because we also have a talent shortage here.
Maintaining Financial Discipline, Adaptability and Agility
Jodi You mentioned earlier that Micron will invest $200 billion in the US over the next few years. Such major decisions ultimately need your final approval.
We also talked earlier about the memory industry often swinging between "feast" and "famine." And many times, it's precisely when the industry is at its toughest, most "famine"-like, that you have to make these massive investment decisions.
How do you make yourself accept this level of risk? When making such decisions, do you ever doubt yourself?
Sanjay I've been in the memory industry for over 45 years now.
I love this industry and have always believed in its potential. I've always believed the best is yet to come.
Now, being able to drive AI forward with customers excites me immensely. And to do that, clearly, investment is necessary.
But investment is never made blindly; it must be disciplined and based on data.
You need to understand the technology, the applications, where those applications are going. You also need to work closely with customers, understand where they are headed in the future, and what role Micron plays in that.
All of this eventually aggregates into our assessment of future demand, also combined with customers' own assessments.
Of course, assessments can sometimes be wrong. Sometimes there might be oversupply, sometimes undersupply.
But in the direction of AI, we believe this demand environment will persist.
So, what we need to do is work closely with customers, understand applications, understand demand trends, also understand the value of memory, and then shift the product portfolio toward higher-value solutions.
On the basis of this strategy continuously advancing and achieving results, we then make corresponding investments based on data, while always maintaining investment discipline.
I emphasize this repeatedly because it's a very important part of Micron's strategy.
Today, we are investing in building a series of new fabs from scratch. The first step is to construct the buildings and infrastructure.
After these buildings are completed, when installing equipment and forming actual production capacity, we will still maintain discipline.
By discipline, I mean continuously evaluating demand forecasts, assessing how much bit growth technological progress can bring, evaluating how product demand will change, and how these changes will affect the supply landscape.
We'll look at these factors together, then manage risks appropriately, and manage capital expenditures in a very efficient manner.
These are all key focus areas for our entire team.
Jodi So do you ever have self-doubt?
Sanjay We don't have self-doubt. We absolutely believe in the opportunity for memory; today, that is very clear.
Of course, in our business, it's always important to maintain adaptability and agility.
Micron has proven this over many years. Yes, we've always maintained financial discipline, but have also demonstrated strong adaptability and agility.
Jodi Many people look at a CEO and think it's a glamorous position. High compensation, can go to the White House, ride on private jets, sounds like many enviable things.
But in reality, being a CEO is a very difficult job. It means immense responsibility and a lot of sacrifice.
So I want to ask you, as an ordinary person, have you ever made certain sacrifices for work that you later looked back on with regret?
Sanjay I don't regret the sacrifices I've made, but I have indeed made sacrifices.
These sacrifices were mostly about time.
Sometimes, it was giving less time to family, less time to my parents, and less time to my extended family.
Throughout my career, these sacrifices have indeed occurred. Because my career path has always been at the forefront of memory technology, which itself is very high-intensity.
This job also required a lot of travel because we've always been a very global company.
I would say the biggest sacrifice was giving less time to loved ones.
Sometimes, I do wish I had spent more time with my parents back then.
A Lucky and Happy "Arranged Marriage"
Jodi You've been married for 42 years, and I just met your wife.
Tell us about this marriage. First, you were initially introduced by your parents, an arranged marriage. Many people might not understand how such marriages operate.
How have you navigated this journey? There must have been many sacrifices on both sides along the way.
Now many young people are also less willing to start families, or might think: "How could I possibly have a very exciting career and a happy family life at the same time?"
Is it even possible?
Sanjay Of course, there have been many time sacrifices here as well.
When I said less time for loved ones, that certainly includes my family, my wife, and my children.
I am very lucky to have a wonderful wife. She has a very calm demeanor, able to navigate various ups and downs in a very balanced way, always remaining rational.
Yes, we were introduced by our parents, married 42 years ago. It was indeed an arranged marriage, but for us, it has been very successful.
An arranged marriage certainly requires commitment and mutual adjustment.
We both made those efforts. And I would say my wife did exceptionally well in this regard. I also had to adjust, had to commit.
So I feel fortunate, blessed, to have such a successful marriage. It has absolutely been an important support in my career journey.
Jodi When you first got married, you actually made a career trade-off.
Because she couldn't come to the US at the time, you changed your original career direction. And Floyd Kvamme played a role in that.
I know Floyd Kvamme as well. A long time ago, we served together on the Empower America board.
Tell me that story.
Sanjay We got married in 1984. At that time, my wife had to wait about a year to a year and a half to get her green card and come to the US.
So during that period, she didn't have a visa to come to the US.
At that time, Floyd Kvamme was the chairman of the startup SEEQ Technology.
Intel was the first company I joined in 1980. Around 1982, SEEQ Technology spun off from Intel, and I joined it.
A few years later, around 1984, I was originally planning to leave SEEQ to join a startup. That company later became Atmel, and I was supposed to be a co-founder of Atmel.
Floyd Kvamme took me out to lunch. As chairman, he was actually trying to persuade me not to leave SEEQ, also trying to persuade me not to participate in founding Atmel.
In the end, I did not join Atmel, nor participate in founding it.
But Floyd Kvamme learned that my wife was still in India at the time. So he said he could arrange for me to work in Europe representing SEEQ, so my wife could join me there.
I immediately seized that opportunity.
Because that way, we could live together at the beginning of our marriage, rather than me being in the US, her in India, waiting for a green card.
So we chose to go to London. She got permission to go to London. I worked as the European Applications Engineering Manager at SEEQ for about a year.
I'm really grateful to Floyd Kvamme.
Because I was still an engineer then, and that experience gave me responsibilities in applications engineering.
I had designed chips myself. In that role, I began to see the challenges customers faced in their applications. I learned a lot about customers, about application scenarios in that year.
It really made me realize how important customers are. You can't develop technology behind closed doors, can't make products in a vacuum. You have to work closely with customers.
So I must say, thanks to Floyd Kvamme, we spent the first year of our marriage together in Europe; that was a very beautiful experience.
It was also a very important career experience. It made me truly understand the value of being "customer-centric." And today, that is one of Micron's core values.
Jodi Speaking of partnership, what are one or two things your wife taught you? Did these later influence your work style as well?
Sanjay In a partnership, she did teach me one thing. Before speaking in haste, stop and think for a moment. Even if just for a few seconds, pause. Otherwise, sometimes you might say things you later regret.
She taught me, before blurting something out, pause, think. That has been very helpful to me, especially in challenging situations.
I can also share an interesting story.
One of my earliest television interviews was long ago on CNBC. Probably in the 2000s, I don't remember the exact year.
It was CNBC's Squawk Box program. The interview was very early, around 5 AM Pacific Time.
That was my first time on national television, so obviously very nervous.
My wife of course watched that interview at home. That was the first time she saw me being interviewed on CNBC.
When I got home, she covered her head with a blanket and calmly said one sentence: "You have a nice smile. Smile more."
That sentence has stayed with me ever since.
Jodi Wow.
Sanjay Because obviously, in that interview I was too nervous, hardly smiled at all.
Ever since then, that sentence has stayed with me. Whether in meetings or public speaking, I remind myself to relax and remember the importance of smiling.
A smile conveys a state and also helps you connect with the audience.
So, yes, she has been a very important coach for me.
Jodi And you do indeed have a nice smile.
You also raised two daughters, who also became engineers later. That's also remarkable. Tell me, how do they view your success and career?
Sanjay For a long time, they actually didn't realize their father was a significant executive in the tech industry.
That's also fine. Because at home, our focus was always on the family itself, on raising the children, on living together. We also tried to separate work from family interactions.
Although I traveled a lot, I always tried my best to stay connected with the children.
Sometimes even when traveling, if they needed help with homework, I would call them.
I remember my older daughter was maybe in eighth grade or already in high school, needed help with some linear algebra. I worked through the problems with her over the phone.
So, even while traveling, I always tried to stay close to my family. By calling daily, talking with the children, I tried to be part of their lives.
As for my two daughters, I am very proud of them. They developed good values growing up, something I absolutely credit to my wife. She gave them those core values, and I am proud they have them.
They have always pursued their passions. Yes, they both ended up becoming engineers. Today, they both work in product management in the tech industry.
Jodi Do you think you played a role in their lives similar to what your father played in yours?
Sanjay I also place great importance on education.
I also made sure my two daughters understood that education is important. I shared with them how education helped my career, helped us get to where we are today.
Just as my parents valued education back then, I certainly emphasized education to the children.
However, there is also a difference. The children grew up in the US, so you have to recognize that growth isn't just about academics; it also includes extracurricular activities.
Our children indeed pursued their passions in areas outside academics. To this day, they still pursue their interests.
In that sense, their upbringing was somewhat different from my own.
Also, we let them choose their own career paths.
My older daughter, when she first entered university, thought she would go the pre-med route. But in her freshman and sophomore years, she quickly switched to engineering.
My younger daughter originally thought she'd lean more toward public policy, but in university, she also quickly switched to engineering.
Jodi Finally, I'd like to end with one question. If people only look at your resume, what would they miss about you as a person?
Sanjay I'd like to say two things.
First, something more amusing. Once, I met a CEO in the semiconductor industry, who still is a CEO in this industry.
It was our first meeting. When he saw me, he said: "Wow, I thought you'd be a tall person."
It's interesting. That is, after seeing my background, my resume, he imagined a very tall person.
So, if people only look at my resume, they wouldn't know I'm actually not tall.
That's the more amusing side.
But more importantly, if people only look at my resume, they wouldn't know how much I love my family.
My children, my daughters, are my entire world. I am incredibly proud of them.
My wife has been the rock of my life.
Now, we also have grandchildren.
Jodi Two, and one more on the way.
Sanjay I have two granddaughters now, a third is about to be born. The two granddaughters are three years old and three months old.
One is on the East Coast, one on the West Coast. But they bring out the child in me.
When I'm with the three-year-old, I play with her like a child. She really thinks I'm a three-year-old just like her.
Whether sliding down slides together, swinging, or crawling into a little tent to read her a book, she thinks I'm her little playmate.
These are things people wouldn't know by just looking at my resume.
Jodi Yes. Very happy to know you a little better today. I believe our listeners will also be happy to see the personal stories behind your success.
Thank you, Sanjay.
Sanjay Jodi, I thoroughly enjoyed this conversation.
Thank you for covering so many topics, also bringing me back to my childhood years. At the same time, we discussed some of the most important issues in this industry.
And thank you for everything you've done for the semiconductor industry over decades.
